Although Tuesday night’s VP Debate is widely viewed as a ‘draw’ (therefore good for Vance and bad for Walz) the biggest takeaway has been Vance’s blowing a smooth/slick performance at the end. When directly challenged by Walz to admit Trump lost the 2020 election Vance refused to do so. Another, less talked about big takeaway is Vance objecting to being ‘sort of’ fact checked. Apparently Trump, Vance and GOP enablers don’t want to let go of this. Keep complaining a-holes. You’ll be handing the Harris/Walz campaign and Democrats in general a gold mine of material for political ads in the closing weeks of this campaign.
As this OpEd from USA Today indicates Republicans see fact-checking as basically UNFAIR. Democrats according to the author Chris Brennan seem more or less agnostic about it. That doesn’t mean Democrats seem willing to ignore GOP whining about being fact-checked however. I’ve expressed thoughts that Walz should have gone after Vance harder than he did, yet in retrospect think at times Walz actually set Vance up and the latter took the bait:
Still, that became an issue when Brennan asked about immigration issues. Walz knocked Vance for previously saying that “if I have to create stories” to get media attention “then that’s what I’m going to do” ‒ in justifying t”he senator’s debunked claims about legal Haitian immigrants who were drawn to Springfield, Ohio, by open jobs.
Walz said those claims “dehumanize and villainize other human beings.
Things went off the rails at that point. Vance has doubled and tripled down on his lie and tried to bluster his way through. It got to the point where when the moderators wanted to move on and Vance wouldn’t shut up they cut his mic. Since Walz had started to talk back to Vance to correct him his mic got cut too. What really stands out though is Vance actually complained:
Vance, openly irritated, tried to keep talking about the topic as O’Donnell attempted to head him off while turning to a question about the economy.
That prompted the sound bite from Vance that you’ll probably hear plenty of times in the next five weeks: “The rules were that you guys weren’t going to fact-check.”
It was a moment of open weakness in what had otherwise been a strong, if not always factual, performance by Vance.
Look, Vance was always going to come across better than Trump did in his own debate. Vance is much smarter, was trained as a lawyer (at Yale) and can string together coherent sentences. Still, knowing he didn’t have to worry about moderators fact-checking him as happened to his boss some (not enough) Vance walked onto that stage with a certain smugness. He knew he’d be able to spread his bullshit with a trowel and that Walz would only be able to clean up part of the mess. He SHOULD have let the moment pass but lost his cool and whined: ‘You’re trying to fact-check me and it’s not FAIR! Waaaahhhh!’ Vance committed an unforced error.
Worse, during the debate Trump was online complaining. Later you had others doing so. Even Britt Hume complained on the air on Fox. It’s like the GOP actually WANTS to tell people they have a freaking RIGHT to lie with impunity and it should be a criminal offense to correct them. Hell, Trump is actually talking about doing exactly that! What matters however and what Democrats need to emphasize is this part of Brennan’s piece:
Which raises the question: What does all that tell you about who is more likely to speak the truth as they compete for control of the White House?
I’ve never seen a debate winner complain about fact-checking by moderators. Harris clearly defeated Trump during their lone debate last month. And Trump has wailed since then about the two ABC News moderators who had the audacity to bring clarity to that conversation.
Now it’s Vance’s turn to play victim, even though his debate with Walz on Tuesday evening was widely – and I’d say accurately – judged a draw between the two candidates.
Here’s what has potential to be the real kicker since both the ticket of Trump/Vance and others might not let this go. The linked OpEd says (accurately) that Vance displayed WEAKNESS. So did Trump and in the moment himself as he blasted the moderators online. However as we know Trump hates weakness. If he and Vance don’t let this go (and this is why Democrats need to push the matter – to provoke them) Trump will start blaming Vance for being WEAK. Even if privately it can drive a wedge between them. If Vance thinks they might lose he’s smart enough to know something else. Tim Walz reminded Vance of why HE was on the stage instead of Mike Pence.
A losing Trump will look for a scapegoat and J.D. Vance might find himself getting in touch with Mike Pence for advice on how to handle the life he’s going to be subjected to!
In the end however the plain truth of the matter is that KellyAnne Conway created a drug for Trump and Trumpism. Its ‘street name’ is “Alternative Facts” and it’s more addictive to Trump and the GOP in general than Oxy. Like any addict Trump, Vance and the rest refuse to get treatment for their addiction. Attempts at ‘Intervention’ have been tried and have failed.
Still, the solution to their butt-hurt over being fact-checked is so obvious a grade school kid could tell it to them – ‘Don’t LIE.’ It’s that simple. If they don’t like being fact-checked then stop with all the freaking LYING.
In the second sentence, I believe it should say, “Vance refused to do so.” Can this get patched? My typing fingers also have lives of their own.
Corrected
If you’re a regular reader of this website, you quickly realize that there will be mistakes in grammar, spelling, and punctuation. Also, there may be occasional content problems, such as the one you mentioned. Learn to overlook these, and correct them in you mind. The facts and ideas presented herein, on a daily basis, greatly outweigh any concerns about the writing. I like the humor, too.
It appears that these identities may have a firm grip on how to be: deceitful liars; duplicitous liars; delusional liars; and demoralised liars. Quite an achievement, if this is correct.
Deceitful – liars who lie to others about facts. Their lies and their reputation go before them. They are both seen, and known, as being untrustworthy.
Duplicitous – liars who lie to others about their values. They’re two-faced and struggle making informed decisions and this eventually trips them up.
Delusional – lie to themselves about facts. They lie to insulate themself from uncomfortable truths and to palliate cognitive dissonance.
Demoralised – lie to themselves about their values. They act counter to what they say contained in their untruth, and do not keep promises made. They have no integrity – personal or otherwise – because it is so compromised.
“Republicans see fact-checking as basically UNFAIR. Democrats according to the author Chris Brennan seem more or less agnostic about it.”
For two reasons,
1. Democrats don’t intentionally lie, they prefer the logic of facts being facts and truth being truth, policies based on facts and truth lead to results that actually work in the real world that can improve people’s lives
2.Facts should be challenged to see if they are lies, Dems don’t want policies based on lies, from experience, they don’t work, and hurt people. Why would you want to hurt people?
And our citizens apparently don’t give a damn about the truth, otherwise how did a pathological liar caught in 30,000 lies get 10 million MORE votes the second time around? Oh and is in the running again! My homeland is full of crap! If not…prove it in November.
You know, it’s way past time for Al Franken to do a sequel to his best-seller, “Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them” with a much more expanded focus on the GOP as a whole, rather than the more limited focus he took with Fox “News” all those years ago.
Hell, Franken could have a whole volume (or series) dedicated solely to Donald Trump.
You know, the two weirdos lie because it is air, water, and food to them. It would be impossible for either of the fools to do a 180 now but more importantly-whining and bitching about fact-checking surely riles their base and they want to keep those people riled at all cost. If they keep their cult members angry and upset it will be easier to get them to become criminals again after the two weirdos lose in November. When it comes to the magat party, keeping the base ignorant, angry, and violent is a campaign strategy.
“That’s a damning answer”. CheckMate🎯 You MAGA’s are so F*UCKED! 🎉🎉 End of story.VOTE BLUE🇺🇸🇺🇸