We know that the terrorist attack on the US Capitol was no joke, despite what Tucker Carlson would like us to believe.

We know that at least some of the terrorists who occupied the building and forced Congressional members to barricade themselves inside their offices or hide in bunkers planned on kidnapping and executing Pence and/or various lawmakers, probably starting with Nancy Pelosi.

Now we know that retired General Barry McCaffrey agrees.

The US narrowly avoided having members of Congress and VP Pence violently seized and killed or injured by a criminal mob incited by President Trump. Law Enforcement must use any level of force required to protect our Constitution and its elected leaders.

Reporter Jonathan Swan wrote in a tweet responding to McCaffrey:

Thank God they didn’t get to him in the Capitol building. Perhaps there are consequences when the President of the United States lies to millions of his supporters telling them the Vice President has the unilateral ability to overturn the result and ensure a second term of Trump.

Was McCaffrey saying that the Capitol Police, DC Police, and National Guard should have used deadly force against the insurrectionists? You bet your ass. Was Swan saying that Trump incited a mob to smash their way inside the Capitol and kill his vice president? You bet your ass.

Now, thanks to analysis by Slate‘s Dan Kois, we have a better idea of just how lethal the terrorists’ intentions were.

Kois opened his article by saying, “I can’t stop thinking about the zip-tie guys.” He should be. So should we. (Ari Melber spent some time on this topic tonight on MSNBC.) Kois wrote:

Amid the photos that flooded social media during Wednesday’s riot at the Capitol—shirtless jokers in horned helmets, dudes pointing at their nuts, dumbasses carrying away souvenirs—the images of the zip-tie guys were quieter, less exuberant, more chilling. And we’d better not forget what they almost managed to do.

Kois wrote that they weren’t just “cosplaying self-styled patriots” who forced their way into the Capitol, ambled around, broke a few objects, stole a few objects, smeared shit on various surfaces, and bumbled their way out.

Not even. For every idiot wearing a horned Chewbacca outfit, there were ten of them in body armor, carrying guns (yes, quite a few guns, as video evidence shows), and zip-ties. Kois reminded his readers that he isn’t talking about the kind of zip-ties you use to close a loaf of bread. These are called “flex cuffs,” and are made specifically to restrain a person, just like actual handcuffs. You can get a set of ten on Amazon for about the amount you’d spend on lunch.

The terrorists, Kois wrote:

walked through the Senate chamber with a sense of purpose. They were not dressed in silly costumes but kitted out in full paramilitary regalia: helmets, armor, camo, holsters with sidearms. At least one had a semi-automatic rifle and 11 Molotov cocktails. At least one, unlike nearly every other right-wing rioter photographed that day, wore a mask that obscured his face.

They went in fast and with a purpose. They didn’t stop to piss on walls or pose for selfies with Capitol Police officers. They went straight for the offices of people like Pelosi, and then to the Senate floor. Almist like they had memorized maps of the layout of the building, which are also available online. Jim Clyburn believes they were hunting him, among others, and knew exactly where to find him.

Kois wrote:

What was that purpose? It wasn’t to pose for photos. It was to use those flex cuffs on someone.

Remember three months ago, when terrorists in Michigan planned to murder Governor Gretchen Whitmer? The terrorists in the Capitol Building had a very similar intent. Kois recalled that, in a group chat, one of the Whitmer would-be assassins debated whether to just shoot her outright — “knock on the door, and when she answers it just cap her” — but decided to kidnap her, take her to a quiet location, and then rape, torture and murder her. Kois added:

Think of that plot, as these men surely did, as a dress rehearsal for what the zip-tie guys wanted to accomplish at the U.S. Capitol on Wednesday.

They brought in flex-cuffs and weapons. They intended to, at the very least, hold people hostage. Did they plan on murdering them? Maybe they planned on dragging them out to the gallows they erected across from the White House. Whatever they had planned, they were very, very serious about it.

For every idiot with a horned helmet, there were ten with military and/or law enforcement experience, who came into the Capitol with an intent and a purpose. Kois wrote:

[T[he long awful course of history reminds us how slippery the slope is from playacting as a strike force to actually behaving as a strike force. Once the zip ties go on, it doesn’t matter whether you’re a “real” terrorist or not.

The terrorists crushed a police officer’s head in with a fire extinguisher. An AP photographer was dragged away and thought he was going to be murdered.

(Remember the “Murder the Media” slogan carved with a knife into a panel inside the Capitol?)

A New York Times photographer was thrown to the floor and thought she was going to be stomped to death.

“At this point, I thought I could be killed and no one would stop them,” she wrote.

This was not just a bunch of role-playing assholes running around mugging for the cellphone cameras. Kois concluded:

If the rioters had been a little quicker through the doors; if senators and representatives hadn’t just moved from their joint session into separate chambers to debate the Arizona challenge and had instead still been packed into one harder-to-evacuate room; if any number of things had happened differently, the three people next in the line of succession for the presidency might have been face to face with those zip-tie guys. And then: Who knows.

I think we do know.

They were armed. They were prepared. They came in with murder on their minds. And we would be damned fools to think this is the last time we’ll see them.

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  1. I watched the clip (glad my dinner was digested) and Carlson’s missive was mostly about so much focus on Trump and it being unhealthy for the country. He’s actually right, but not for the reason he states. Trump DEMANDS all the focus to be on him and anytime he feels he’s not the center of attention he says or does something outrageous that no responsible journalist can ignore, much as they’d like to. So numbnuts Tucker Carlson (in old Corps jargon “numbnuts” is someone who’s head is shove up their own butt cutting off circulation to their balls!) isn’t just way off base here, he’s not even in the ballpark. As for much of the riot not being such a big deal, if he thinks it was mostly joking around like a college prank gone a little out of hand (he knows better – he’s not THAT stupid) his pasty white-privileged butt is in the minority. I’d never break the law, and it would take all the discipline my DI’s (and coaches when I was in sports) pumped into me to refrain from smashing him in his stupid mouth. I’ll confess however I’d LOVE for him to take a swing at me so I could defend myself. I might be old and fat and need a cane for balance so he might think he could get away with it but he’d be in for a rude surprise!

    • Damn. I might have used the wrong link to Carlson’s drivel. He was talking in one clip about how the attack was just an ordinary protest that got a little out of hand.

      • Going to be hard to go after Fox News and corporate owners… but their sponsors and advertisers are another matter.

        Tucker is just… an idiot for one. Chutzpah doesn’t cover his … behavior.

  2. Obviously, there was limits to their prep, training, intel and/or leadership. Otherwise, a lot of Congress folk would no longer be walking this earth. The confirmed information above suggests that things went wrong in the manner of the Bay of Pigs invasion in ’62 or the attempted Russian coup in ’91. Pros don’t like that don’t typically make too many tactical errors unless something really went sideways.

    • There’s more than a little suspicion that they had inside information. Boebert and Greene and Mo Brooks would be obvious places to start, along with Hawley and Tuberville.

      It shouldn’t be easy to find maps of the tunnel system on the Hill.

        • Timing would have had to be a tricky issue for them. Ordinarily the process takes perhaps a half hour from start to finish. That might seem like an adequate window of opportunity but if the overall plan was to use a mob as cover for the special ops members of the coup (you know – the zip tie dudes in full tactical gear who’s faces were WELL hidden) to kidnap certain people, AND they wanted to make sure they not only got the people they wanted PLUS have the Electoral College Certificates (with the accompanying ballots) laying out there for the mob to find and destroy they had to allow the process to get underway. They’d need the mob, the regular ass-hats to get close to the House chamber and in enough numbers to provide cover for the actual kidnappings, and regardless of however many co-conspirators they had in the Capitol Police they had to be mindful of Secret Service Special Agents who wouldn’t hesitate to (accurately) shoot to kill. Not to mention Pence wasn’t the only one with that kind of protection. Btw the Secret Service jealously protects its protocols but it’s a no-brainer that with not just the VP but so many high value targets around whenever the VP is in the Capitol presiding over the Senate (or in this case the House) they’d have some pretty heavy hardware within almost arm’s reach. Stuff that body armor or not would not only knock down an attacker but stun them badly enough (cracked ribs are painful as hell, and a head shot would be life threatening if not fatal at those ranges) that the bad guys had to be careful. Again, they needed LOTS of confusion and at just the right time to have enough people in the chamber (both the bad guy spec ops terrorists and the larger group of Rambo wannabe terrorists) to accomplish their mission.

          It wasn’t just loyal Capitol Police slowing things down just enough, but quick thinking staffers piling furniture at some key spots to block doors that bought just enough time to evacuate the good guys. Yes, the bad guys had inside info. on escape routes but I’m betting the plan was to allow the spec ops, the zip tie goons to operate within a larger mob. To allow them to grab and zip tie the main targets and some extras, and hand them over to mob ringleaders who they knew intended to either do a hostage standoff and start maybe doing executions or more likely drag them outside for mob “justice” and the small team of the strike force, the Erik Prince (?) type dudes to slip away in some manner and leave “civilians” to take all the blame.

          Whether the special squad wasn’t as good as they thought they were, or when it was crunch time and they realized both how many Special Agents they’d have to contend with and chickened out over engaging with people who are just as tough and well trained AND better equipped, or the timing and goals were too ambitious or some combination of all that the plot failed.

          I can’t help but wonder if the zip tie dudes who I believe might well have been mercs on Erik Prince’s payroll (or one of his pals) who are more used to engaging third world NOT real troops or poorly trained and equipped ones and KNEW the kind of security personnel around the truly high value targets AND the kind of weaponry those protecting those targets had at arms reach paused. And thought “You know what? THEY have the upper hand, and dressed the way I am they will spot me in a heartbeat and THEY will take me down first! And the sound of the shots they fire will scare the hell out of the amateurs I’m supposed to use as cover and I’ll likely wind up unconscious on the floor or dead an fuckit – I didn’t sign up for THAT!” and again, basically “choked” at the crucial moment.

          I truly believe they were supposed to be covert, as in detain and hand over to certain members of the mob their targets and slip away and for special ops people part of success in most missions is no one knows they were involved. Don’t let the tactical gear fool you. Lots of the Rambo wannabes buy and wear the same shit and you see it at gatherings of MAGAts all the time. But grabbing targets on evacuation routes wouldn’t be covert. And breaching doors with high explosive and deploying nerve agents to knock people out would have caused a panic with the unwitting, regular guy/gal terrorists who mostly would have fled at the sound of real, military grade explosives (quite different than their homemade crap – I know from experience) and again it would have blown their covert status. Or so they could tell their boss who would probably give them the benefit of the doubt. A “merc” boss like Prince would value keeping his fingerprints off the operation above all else.

          Yes, I keep thinking about him. And his baby sister Betsy (DeVoss) suddenly resigning is something I find interesting. As I said earlier elsewhere it will be interesting to see if she goes on vacation, either overseas or perhaps on one of her dozen or so yachts, in or a couple of minutes from international waters. Because her brother suggested it would be good for her to make some space between her and authorities. Not saying she was in on anything or knew much about it but even knowing a little would be bad for big brother. Just knowing he was working to “help Trump out” would be enough to shine the spotlight on him and his whole, ugly operation so he’d want to be able to easily get her off to a non-extradition country for a life of exile in luxury.

          Ok, I’ve been rambling. It’s the middle of the night and I couldn’t get back to sleep but my eyelids have started drooping. Sorry about this being sloppily organized and more “say it as it occurs to me” stuff.

          • There’s something to your theory about Prince’s involvement, Denis. And I am just cynical and ill-tempered enough to believe that the spec ops team didn’t plan for REAL opposition to be in their way. As I saw in a YouTube video on why corporations make lousy fictional bad guys (of all things), they explained how most PMCs are only good enough to take Third World military and militias. Put them against regular armed forces and they are hopelessly outgunned from the start. So it likely went here.

            Three other things to watch for in the coming weeks: a) how many zip-tie guys let their own faces be seen, b) how quickly any of this gets traced back to Prince and c) how quickly Prince, if involved, throws Trump and Co under the bus.

          • Or some folks go to 3rd world countries with no extradition treaties. So much cash can be moved… easily ?? Or, they already have some moved.

            Keep thinking Jar Jar and Ivanka go to Israel. The USA won’t break with Israel… too much weapons and history… Keep thinking they have info … that we need. ie Iran. And they do seem to test (and fix) our best military equipment.

  3. And Trump’s loyal henchmen are to blame. Both Lin Wood and earlier, Mike Flynn, earned kudos or proposing the execution of Mike Pence.

  4. I believe their exposed plan for the governor of michigan was ” rape, torture, execute”. Don’t know if there were any “father rapers”(thanx arlo guthrie), but the plan for the women was set some time ago.

  5. The guy in the top pix has been identified as Eric Munchel – bartender from Tennessee who came with his mother sitting by him. No clue if he’s been arrested. Another flex cuff idiot was Lt. Colonel Ret. Larry Brock of Texas and was an Air Force Academy grad. Arrested.

    • According to wiki… sedition has some… issues. First Amendment. But some acts … espionage …for one, 20 years?

      I am sure there will be a bigger charge… conspiracy.

  6. MI certainly acted as practice, from the time armed insurrectionists took over the MI state capitol building. In addition,those unidentified fake cops in the NW was another practice march. I have a sneaking suspicion all of these violent attacks involve Erik Prince’s mercenaries. Certainly the mob at the Capitol contained killers! Five people died! Yes it could have been worse. And it will get worse, without swift severe consequences for every one involved.

  7. We would be damn fools, Max. There is talk going around now on social media and elsewhere about even worse for Jan. 17, 2021. It involves not only the US Capital, but State Capitals as well. I haven’t seen any details; I’m not up on social media, but it’s enough to rattle my nerves a bit.

  8. There was a headline today that was something like “FBI trying to determine if zip ties were intended for violent use.” Which is sort of a silly question when you look at the photos.

    A legal question that will almost surely come up – Joe Blow breaks into a property and participate in a criminal riot. Joe doesn’t have deadly weapons, but others do and it can be shown Joe knew others did. Is Joe now culpable for even more egregious criminal charges?

    • Methinks the federal prosecutors… with new supervision will have the legal brains and experience. And thinking still more to come out. The Deep State… just goes “wth… they have no encryption… this wanton…” :: and strikes back.

  9. Thank you for all of these incredibly useful sources. I’ll be bookmarking this story so that I can remember them. Finding clear footage from that shit-show can be a struggle. But what happened was truly chilling, and it’s refreshing to hear someone point out, yet again, that we almost had outright executions from these fascists.

  10. I have been predicting a civil war for decades since Reagan. The Rethugs stoke it with every racist and anti-citizen act they perform, every vote they try to suppress, every district the gerrymander, every supreme court and federal court judge the either resist or place as sympathizers to their power grab. The mob on the 6th proves my prediction, as part lynch mob, part, terrorist group, and part army if opposition. they need to be hunted down, caught, tried, found guilty and severely punished. This civil war has not a shred of justification ,. . . yet. But if it is not regarded and TREATED as something more than an aberration, we are in deep doodoo.


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